Best PSU solution for 4 x GTX 295
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Hi, I'd like to hear Your opinion. I'm currently [url="http://estoniadonates.wordpress.com/"]running 3 x 295 system and building 4 card system[/url]. What is the best PSU solution to system, employing 4 x GTX 295 cards. Each has 6-pin and 8-pin PCI-E and consumes about 290 Watts.

main questions:

1. have I go to 1 large or 2 smaller PSU-s?
2. is 40 Amp 12 V rail enough for 2 cards?
3. what is best solution for syncing 2 PSU-s?
4. What is vest price(performance PSU in EU market, 230 Volts?

thanks in advance
Hi, I'd like to hear Your opinion. I'm currently running 3 x 295 system and building 4 card system. What is the best PSU solution to system, employing 4 x GTX 295 cards. Each has 6-pin and 8-pin PCI-E and consumes about 290 Watts.



main questions:



1. have I go to 1 large or 2 smaller PSU-s?

2. is 40 Amp 12 V rail enough for 2 cards?

3. what is best solution for syncing 2 PSU-s?

4. What is vest price(performance PSU in EU market, 230 Volts?



thanks in advance

#1
Posted 02/18/2009 09:08 AM   
[quote name='jaakennuste' post='507320' date='Feb 18 2009, 10:08 AM']Hi, I'd like to hear Your opinion. I'm currently [url="http://estoniadonates.wordpress.com/"]running 3 x 295 system and building 4 card system[/url]. What is the best PSU solution to system, employing 4 x GTX 295 cards. Each has 6-pin and 8-pin PCI-E and consumes about 290 Watts.

main questions:

1. have I go to 1 large or 2 smaller PSU-s?
2. is 40 Amp 12 V rail enough for 2 cards?
3. what is best solution for syncing 2 PSU-s?
4. What is vest price(performance PSU in EU market, 230 Volts?

thanks in advance[/quote]

Hi, I also am interested in using a system with multiple GTX985, so we can get in touch. First of all I am looking for a system with 2 GTX295 into a single workstation, but if possible also systems with 3-4 boards will be wellcome.
Can you tell me how have you manage to arrange 3 GTX295 into a single workstation?
Thank you.
[quote name='jaakennuste' post='507320' date='Feb 18 2009, 10:08 AM']Hi, I'd like to hear Your opinion. I'm currently running 3 x 295 system and building 4 card system. What is the best PSU solution to system, employing 4 x GTX 295 cards. Each has 6-pin and 8-pin PCI-E and consumes about 290 Watts.



main questions:



1. have I go to 1 large or 2 smaller PSU-s?

2. is 40 Amp 12 V rail enough for 2 cards?

3. what is best solution for syncing 2 PSU-s?

4. What is vest price(performance PSU in EU market, 230 Volts?



thanks in advance



Hi, I also am interested in using a system with multiple GTX985, so we can get in touch. First of all I am looking for a system with 2 GTX295 into a single workstation, but if possible also systems with 3-4 boards will be wellcome.

Can you tell me how have you manage to arrange 3 GTX295 into a single workstation?

Thank you.

#2
Posted 02/18/2009 10:16 AM   
[quote name='neuron' post='507332' date='Feb 18 2009, 12:16 PM']Hi, I also am interested in using a system with multiple GTX985, so we can get in touch. First of all I am looking for a system with 2 GTX295 into a single workstation, but if possible also systems with 3-4 boards will be wellcome.
Can you tell me how have you manage to arrange 3 GTX295 into a single workstation?
Thank you.[/quote]

Neoron:

Please [url="http://estoniadonates.wordpress.com/our-supercomputer/"]read my personal supercomputer blog[/url] and You'll find all the answers how to run system with 6 GPU-s.

[url="http://estoniadonates.wordpress.com/our-supercomputer/"]http://estoniadonates.wordpress.com/our-supercomputer/[/url]

Jaak
[quote name='neuron' post='507332' date='Feb 18 2009, 12:16 PM']Hi, I also am interested in using a system with multiple GTX985, so we can get in touch. First of all I am looking for a system with 2 GTX295 into a single workstation, but if possible also systems with 3-4 boards will be wellcome.

Can you tell me how have you manage to arrange 3 GTX295 into a single workstation?

Thank you.



Neoron:



Please read my personal supercomputer blog and You'll find all the answers how to run system with 6 GPU-s.



http://estoniadonates.wordpress.com/our-supercomputer/



Jaak

#3
Posted 02/18/2009 11:27 AM   
[quote name='jaakennuste' post='507320' date='Feb 18 2009, 04:08 AM']Hi, I'd like to hear Your opinion. I'm currently [url="http://estoniadonates.wordpress.com/"]running 3 x 295 system and building 4 card system[/url]. What is the best PSU solution to system, employing 4 x GTX 295 cards. Each has 6-pin and 8-pin PCI-E and consumes about 290 Watts.

main questions:

1. have I go to 1 large or 2 smaller PSU-s?
2. is 40 Amp 12 V rail enough for 2 cards?
3. what is best solution for syncing 2 PSU-s?
4. What is vest price(performance PSU in EU market, 230 Volts?

thanks in advance[/quote]

We've been using the new Enermax Revolution PSU (1050W - North American 115V version) with good results on systems with three GTX280s (TDP 246W each). The PSU is quiet and 85%+ efficient.

The top European model at 1250W [url="http://enermax.de/en/products/power-supply/revolution85.html"]http://enermax.de/en/products/power-supply/revolution85.html[/url] would almost certainly be enough to power your four 295s with 87%+ efficiency @230V. It provides eight 8-pin PCI-E power connectors on modular cables.

Testing an X58 Intel system with three GTX280s at full power, we have never seen a system power draw of more than 800W. It appears to be difficult to reach full rated power consumption in GPGPU applications.

The real challenge of multi-GPU setups is not the PSU, but rather cooling!
[quote name='jaakennuste' post='507320' date='Feb 18 2009, 04:08 AM']Hi, I'd like to hear Your opinion. I'm currently running 3 x 295 system and building 4 card system. What is the best PSU solution to system, employing 4 x GTX 295 cards. Each has 6-pin and 8-pin PCI-E and consumes about 290 Watts.



main questions:



1. have I go to 1 large or 2 smaller PSU-s?

2. is 40 Amp 12 V rail enough for 2 cards?

3. what is best solution for syncing 2 PSU-s?

4. What is vest price(performance PSU in EU market, 230 Volts?



thanks in advance



We've been using the new Enermax Revolution PSU (1050W - North American 115V version) with good results on systems with three GTX280s (TDP 246W each). The PSU is quiet and 85%+ efficient.



The top European model at 1250W http://enermax.de/en/products/power-supply/revolution85.html would almost certainly be enough to power your four 295s with 87%+ efficiency @230V. It provides eight 8-pin PCI-E power connectors on modular cables.



Testing an X58 Intel system with three GTX280s at full power, we have never seen a system power draw of more than 800W. It appears to be difficult to reach full rated power consumption in GPGPU applications.



The real challenge of multi-GPU setups is not the PSU, but rather cooling!

#4
Posted 02/18/2009 04:13 PM   
[quote name='ldpaniak' post='507476' date='Feb 18 2009, 06:13 PM']We've been using the new Enermax Revolution PSU (1050W - North American 115V version) with good results on systems with three GTX280s (TDP 246W each). The PSU is quiet and 85%+ efficient.

The top European model at 1250W [url="http://enermax.de/en/products/power-supply/revolution85.html"]http://enermax.de/en/products/power-supply/revolution85.html[/url] would almost certainly be enough to power your four 295s with 87%+ efficiency @230V. It provides eight 8-pin PCI-E power connectors on modular cables.

Testing an X58 Intel system with three GTX280s at full power, we have never seen a system power draw of more than 800W. It appears to be difficult to reach full rated power consumption in GPGPU applications.

The real challenge of multi-GPU setups is not the PSU, but rather cooling![/quote]

Thanks for valuable tip. Enermax look very potent...

Jaak
[quote name='ldpaniak' post='507476' date='Feb 18 2009, 06:13 PM']We've been using the new Enermax Revolution PSU (1050W - North American 115V version) with good results on systems with three GTX280s (TDP 246W each). The PSU is quiet and 85%+ efficient.



The top European model at 1250W http://enermax.de/en/products/power-supply/revolution85.html would almost certainly be enough to power your four 295s with 87%+ efficiency @230V. It provides eight 8-pin PCI-E power connectors on modular cables.



Testing an X58 Intel system with three GTX280s at full power, we have never seen a system power draw of more than 800W. It appears to be difficult to reach full rated power consumption in GPGPU applications.



The real challenge of multi-GPU setups is not the PSU, but rather cooling!



Thanks for valuable tip. Enermax look very potent...



Jaak

#5
Posted 02/20/2009 09:16 AM   
[quote name='jaakennuste' post='508248' date='Feb 20 2009, 10:16 AM']Thanks for valuable tip. Enermax look very potent...

Jaak[/quote]

I'm not sure if the two 30A rails for mainboard and CPU will deliver enough power to the PCIe bus. Keep in mind that those cards in total will draw up to 300W from the PCIe bus!

My recommendation (following the FASTRA recommendation) for a 4xGTX295 setup still is the Thermaltake ToughPower 1500W. My system has been running for the past two weeks non-stop at full load without a single issue.

joar
[quote name='jaakennuste' post='508248' date='Feb 20 2009, 10:16 AM']Thanks for valuable tip. Enermax look very potent...



Jaak



I'm not sure if the two 30A rails for mainboard and CPU will deliver enough power to the PCIe bus. Keep in mind that those cards in total will draw up to 300W from the PCIe bus!



My recommendation (following the FASTRA recommendation) for a 4xGTX295 setup still is the Thermaltake ToughPower 1500W. My system has been running for the past two weeks non-stop at full load without a single issue.



joar

#6
Posted 02/20/2009 10:29 AM   
[quote name='jaakennuste' post='507320' date='Feb 18 2009, 04:08 AM']Hi, I'd like to hear Your opinion. I'm currently [url="http://estoniadonates.wordpress.com/"]running 3 x 295 system and building 4 card system[/url]. What is the best PSU solution to system, employing 4 x GTX 295 cards. Each has 6-pin and 8-pin PCI-E and consumes about 290 Watts.

main questions:

1. have I go to 1 large or 2 smaller PSU-s?
2. is 40 Amp 12 V rail enough for 2 cards?
3. what is best solution for syncing 2 PSU-s?
4. What is vest price(performance PSU in EU market, 230 Volts?

thanks in advance[/quote]

Hi

Sorry, I don't have the answer - I have another question instead. Can you tell the exact configuration with which it is possible to have 4 x GTX 295 in one box? We're planning to buy these, but not sure about other hardware needed.

Thanks
Artem
[quote name='jaakennuste' post='507320' date='Feb 18 2009, 04:08 AM']Hi, I'd like to hear Your opinion. I'm currently running 3 x 295 system and building 4 card system. What is the best PSU solution to system, employing 4 x GTX 295 cards. Each has 6-pin and 8-pin PCI-E and consumes about 290 Watts.



main questions:



1. have I go to 1 large or 2 smaller PSU-s?

2. is 40 Amp 12 V rail enough for 2 cards?

3. what is best solution for syncing 2 PSU-s?

4. What is vest price(performance PSU in EU market, 230 Volts?



thanks in advance



Hi



Sorry, I don't have the answer - I have another question instead. Can you tell the exact configuration with which it is possible to have 4 x GTX 295 in one box? We're planning to buy these, but not sure about other hardware needed.



Thanks

Artem

#7
Posted 02/20/2009 08:37 PM   
[quote name='zhmurov' post='508428' date='Feb 20 2009, 10:37 PM']Hi

Sorry, I don't have the answer - I have another question instead. Can you tell the exact configuration with which it is possible to have 4 x GTX 295 in one box? We're planning to buy these, but not sure about other hardware needed.

Thanks
Artem[/quote]

Right [b]motherboard [/b]is the key -- MSI K9A2 Platinum, having 4 PCI x16 slots with space in between to house double-fat cards. [b]Power supply[/b] is another key - it should be 1250-1500 Watt unit with enough PCI-E connectors. [b]Case [/b]must support 8 cards, not 7 as usual. And last, [b]operating system[/b] should be either XP x32 or x64, not Vista, not Win 7. Driver compatibility is real issue.

Please read [url="http://estoniadonates.wordpress.com/"]my folding blog[/url] to find specific models and solutions.

[url="http://estoniadonates.wordpress.com/"]http://estoniadonates.wordpress.com/[/url]

Jaak
[quote name='zhmurov' post='508428' date='Feb 20 2009, 10:37 PM']Hi



Sorry, I don't have the answer - I have another question instead. Can you tell the exact configuration with which it is possible to have 4 x GTX 295 in one box? We're planning to buy these, but not sure about other hardware needed.



Thanks

Artem



Right motherboard is the key -- MSI K9A2 Platinum, having 4 PCI x16 slots with space in between to house double-fat cards. Power supply is another key - it should be 1250-1500 Watt unit with enough PCI-E connectors. Case must support 8 cards, not 7 as usual. And last, operating system should be either XP x32 or x64, not Vista, not Win 7. Driver compatibility is real issue.



Please read my folding blog to find specific models and solutions.



http://estoniadonates.wordpress.com/



Jaak

#8
Posted 02/21/2009 03:03 PM   
[quote name='joar' post='508266' date='Feb 20 2009, 05:29 AM']I'm not sure if the two 30A rails for mainboard and CPU will deliver enough power to the PCIe bus. Keep in mind that those cards in total will draw up to 300W from the PCIe bus!

My recommendation (following the FASTRA recommendation) for a 4xGTX295 setup still is the Thermaltake ToughPower 1500W. My system has been running for the past two weeks non-stop at full load without a single issue.

joar[/quote]

Good point.

I'm not sure what kind of motherboard you are using (MSI?), but for the Asus M3A79-T there is a BIOS entry for "GPP Slots Power Limit" which comes with the default value of 25W. I would guess the same option exists on all boards with a 790FX chipset.

The questions are:
Is this limit in BIOS effective? Does it really limit power draw from the motherboard?
and
Can a GTX295 run with only 25W from the motherboard? It appears that dual-GPU cards from ATI/AMD may need more.
[quote name='joar' post='508266' date='Feb 20 2009, 05:29 AM']I'm not sure if the two 30A rails for mainboard and CPU will deliver enough power to the PCIe bus. Keep in mind that those cards in total will draw up to 300W from the PCIe bus!



My recommendation (following the FASTRA recommendation) for a 4xGTX295 setup still is the Thermaltake ToughPower 1500W. My system has been running for the past two weeks non-stop at full load without a single issue.



joar



Good point.



I'm not sure what kind of motherboard you are using (MSI?), but for the Asus M3A79-T there is a BIOS entry for "GPP Slots Power Limit" which comes with the default value of 25W. I would guess the same option exists on all boards with a 790FX chipset.



The questions are:

Is this limit in BIOS effective? Does it really limit power draw from the motherboard?

and

Can a GTX295 run with only 25W from the motherboard? It appears that dual-GPU cards from ATI/AMD may need more.

#9
Posted 02/21/2009 03:18 PM   
[quote name='ldpaniak' post='508759' date='Feb 21 2009, 09:18 AM']Can a GTX295 run with only 25W from the motherboard? It appears that dual-GPU cards from ATI/AMD may need more.[/quote]

This might be a problem (at least in theory). The spec sheet says the GTX 295 has a maximum power draw of 289W. The 6-pin PCI-E connector is rated to supply 75W, the 8-pin connector is rated for 150W, and the PCI-E slot itself provides another 75W. If the slot is limited to 25W, then the most that can be delivered to the card is 250W.

That said, I doubt the GTX 295 actually hits 289W in practice, but I don't know what happens if you start to bump up against this limit.
[quote name='ldpaniak' post='508759' date='Feb 21 2009, 09:18 AM']Can a GTX295 run with only 25W from the motherboard? It appears that dual-GPU cards from ATI/AMD may need more.



This might be a problem (at least in theory). The spec sheet says the GTX 295 has a maximum power draw of 289W. The 6-pin PCI-E connector is rated to supply 75W, the 8-pin connector is rated for 150W, and the PCI-E slot itself provides another 75W. If the slot is limited to 25W, then the most that can be delivered to the card is 250W.



That said, I doubt the GTX 295 actually hits 289W in practice, but I don't know what happens if you start to bump up against this limit.

#10
Posted 02/21/2009 06:08 PM   
Ok, I went for 2 PSU solution because of 2 main reasons, covered here: [url="http://estoniadonates.wordpress.com/"]http://estoniadonates.wordpress.com/[/url]

One rack module:
[img]http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3581/3407448736_51dbc957ee.jpg[/img]

Entire rig:
[img]http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3383/3408904030_a205c0dc5e_o.jpg[/img]

Synchronising 2 PSU-s works well and no problems whatsoever....
Ok, I went for 2 PSU solution because of 2 main reasons, covered here: http://estoniadonates.wordpress.com/



One rack module:

Image



Entire rig:

Image



Synchronising 2 PSU-s works well and no problems whatsoever....

#11
Posted 04/03/2009 05:22 AM   
Jaak - You've been a big help to us all and I want to thank you for that. I hear you on the dual PSU solution and that is what we do in the lab when running four GTX 295's. Unfortunately, for use within enclosed cases with limited room it has to be a single PSU to fit inside the box. We would like to find a good single PSU solution that can run four GTX 295s.

The best so far appears to be the Enermax Jaak cites on his truly superb and useful web page, but it is only available in the US in a 1050W version. This apparently is exactly the same PSU, with a different AC power cord, that is sold as a 1250W unit in the UK. It is good for 1250W when run on European 220V power but is rated only at 1050W when run on lower US AC voltage.

So far we've not been able to find a 1250W to 1500W PSU in the US that has four six-pin and four eight-pin PCI-E cables. I think the problem is that it is difficult to get UL approval for the higher wattage PSUs in the US. Does anyone know of such a PSU?
Jaak - You've been a big help to us all and I want to thank you for that. I hear you on the dual PSU solution and that is what we do in the lab when running four GTX 295's. Unfortunately, for use within enclosed cases with limited room it has to be a single PSU to fit inside the box. We would like to find a good single PSU solution that can run four GTX 295s.



The best so far appears to be the Enermax Jaak cites on his truly superb and useful web page, but it is only available in the US in a 1050W version. This apparently is exactly the same PSU, with a different AC power cord, that is sold as a 1250W unit in the UK. It is good for 1250W when run on European 220V power but is rated only at 1050W when run on lower US AC voltage.



So far we've not been able to find a 1250W to 1500W PSU in the US that has four six-pin and four eight-pin PCI-E cables. I think the problem is that it is difficult to get UL approval for the higher wattage PSUs in the US. Does anyone know of such a PSU?

#12
Posted 04/10/2009 07:44 PM   
how does the master / slave psu work? I see the pictures on your site; you said something like "One solution is to make cable"... more details would be interesting if you have time.
how does the master / slave psu work? I see the pictures on your site; you said something like "One solution is to make cable"... more details would be interesting if you have time.

#13
Posted 04/10/2009 10:01 PM   
[quote name='gatoatigrado' post='528853' date='Apr 10 2009, 03:01 PM']how does the master / slave psu work? I see the pictures on your site; you said something like "One solution is to make cable"... more details would be interesting if you have time.[/quote]

The way power supplies (PSUs) work is that you plug them into the motherboard through the main 24 pin socket and then when you turn on the motherboard that tells the PSU to turn on. If you have two standard PC power supplies, only one of them is plugged into the motherboard. How do you get the other one to turn on? The solution is to have a little bridge adapter cable that brings out a second 24 pin socket into which the second PSU plugs into to make it think it is attached to the motherboard. The power on signal from the motherboard is the only wiring to that second socket.

You can wire that up yourself or buy pre-made units like this:

[url="http://www.frozencpu.com/products/5637/cpa-167/Lian_Li_Dual_Power_Supply_Adapter_Cable.html"]http://www.frozencpu.com/products/5637/cpa...pter_Cable.html[/url]

They work great. Power up the motherboard and both PSUs turn on.

By the way, on my other post I got some private emails suggesting the ENERMAX GALAXY EVO EGX1250EWT-01, at 1250W. This is not as efficient as the Revolution, but it seems to have a total of 8 6+2 PCI-E cables. Anyone using that?

Also, on the water-cooling front we have... [url="http://www.koolance.com/water-cooling/product_info.php?product_id=665"]http://www.koolance.com/water-cooling/prod...?product_id=665[/url] with a review at [url="http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTUyOSwxLCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdA=="]http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html...W50aHVzaWFzdA==[/url] ... however, looking at how they load power to the 12V rails from the review it looks like despite having up to 1300W you can't split that four ways with enough amperage to each of four GTX 295 cards. :-( What do other folks think about that? Am I missing something?
[quote name='gatoatigrado' post='528853' date='Apr 10 2009, 03:01 PM']how does the master / slave psu work? I see the pictures on your site; you said something like "One solution is to make cable"... more details would be interesting if you have time.



The way power supplies (PSUs) work is that you plug them into the motherboard through the main 24 pin socket and then when you turn on the motherboard that tells the PSU to turn on. If you have two standard PC power supplies, only one of them is plugged into the motherboard. How do you get the other one to turn on? The solution is to have a little bridge adapter cable that brings out a second 24 pin socket into which the second PSU plugs into to make it think it is attached to the motherboard. The power on signal from the motherboard is the only wiring to that second socket.



You can wire that up yourself or buy pre-made units like this:



http://www.frozencpu.com/products/5637/cpa...pter_Cable.html



They work great. Power up the motherboard and both PSUs turn on.



By the way, on my other post I got some private emails suggesting the ENERMAX GALAXY EVO EGX1250EWT-01, at 1250W. This is not as efficient as the Revolution, but it seems to have a total of 8 6+2 PCI-E cables. Anyone using that?



Also, on the water-cooling front we have... http://www.koolance.com/water-cooling/prod...?product_id=665 with a review at http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html...W50aHVzaWFzdA== ... however, looking at how they load power to the 12V rails from the review it looks like despite having up to 1300W you can't split that four ways with enough amperage to each of four GTX 295 cards. :-( What do other folks think about that? Am I missing something?

#14
Posted 04/10/2009 11:08 PM   
Thanks!

From 80plus.org, it looks like some of the gold certified (90% efficiency) power supplies are going to start being sold in a few months; it seems like most are around the 750w range though (and the enermax revolution is already very good).
Thanks!



From 80plus.org, it looks like some of the gold certified (90% efficiency) power supplies are going to start being sold in a few months; it seems like most are around the 750w range though (and the enermax revolution is already very good).

#15
Posted 04/11/2009 08:56 AM   
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